tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post3342393237384028317..comments2024-03-17T06:03:00.362-04:00Comments on Fiction University: The Line Forms Where? Knowing Where to Start Your NovelJanice Hardyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02356672149097741248noreply@blogger.comBlogger25125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-45710545071553134082019-01-26T08:24:30.670-05:002019-01-26T08:24:30.670-05:00Sure. The same basic principles apply to any begin...Sure. The same basic principles apply to any beginning. Janice Hardyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02356672149097741248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-31433731315083356962019-01-25T18:24:53.747-05:002019-01-25T18:24:53.747-05:00Janice, this looks like something I could use for ...Janice, this looks like something I could use for each and every scene. What do you think?G. J. Jollyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08673879337644445397noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-59001939875619552142016-07-07T21:26:18.654-04:002016-07-07T21:26:18.654-04:00I started in the wrong spot I went too far ahead a...I started in the wrong spot I went too far ahead and confused people. Yes I'm backwards. XD Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-21971662345909056492016-06-07T15:59:52.589-04:002016-06-07T15:59:52.589-04:00That's a tough one since anything that feels t...That's a tough one since anything that feels too detached might risk losing them.<br /><br />I just started reading something that might help you. The Good, the Bad, and the Infernal. It's mostly third person multi viewpoint, but there's a first person viewpoint as well, and so far, this person feels like maybe they're central to everything. <br /><br />If you did that one POV in first person, you could avoid using the name and any details that would give the person away, but still let readers see that they're supposed to follow and care about this person. <br /><br />It's a tricky POV, but maybe something like that could work for you?<br /><br />I think it would depend on how long you want to hide the identity of the character. If it's only a few pages, some clever narrative and internalization can hide it. But if it's longer, you'd need something else.<br /><br />Hope that helps!Janice Hardyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02356672149097741248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-52425560712148363132016-05-28T22:26:30.110-04:002016-05-28T22:26:30.110-04:00There are great things I can take away from this, ...There are great things I can take away from this, but I'm still running into the issues of making my character interesting/distinct enough for readers (this is a GOT style multi viewpoint story, with each chapter about a different character) and ending the chapter well. There isn't a build up like you mentioned, I have the main character going outside to her garden at the end. I defiantly describe my main character's life and show what one of her goals is:feeling/being safe. This worry for her own well being and inability to protect herself physically makes doing the main goal (she is the heir to the throne of the kingdom and has to reclaim the throne) more difficult, and it causes the story to unfold, since her only protector is taken hostage the next time I visit her character. Also, later in the book, we see she is more concerned with others than herself. <br /><br />I'm concerned because I don't people to know who the main character is on page one, but I do want them to keep reading. I want people to see her actions and what she experiences through her eyes, and then learn that it is her and that her main goal is to retake the kingdom in order to save all of the people she's just come into contact with in the first few chapters.<br /><br />Any advice? Maybe have her go outside and then include...and then continue her story a bit more?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-67119020640281292712015-01-04T10:35:51.839-05:002015-01-04T10:35:51.839-05:00No, it's not bad at all, and that's a comm...No, it's not bad at all, and that's a common way to start a novel. Being bullied is a good example, as that shows conflict, a problem, and something the protagonist has to deal with that could hook a reader, and transitions well into the much more horrific "bullying" near rape. It would be even more impactful if the bullying is what put her in the bad situation to almost be raped in the first place. Cause leads to effect. Janice Hardyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02356672149097741248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-34230001983732583472015-01-03T01:01:54.567-05:002015-01-03T01:01:54.567-05:00My inciting incident is a near-rape scene, in whic...My inciting incident is a near-rape scene, in which the antihero intervenes (his first appearance). That doesn't seem like the kind of thing I should start off the first few lines with. Is it really that bad to start with something a little more mundane, like the errand leading up to it, or the time she gets bullied before she's sent on the errand?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-61634995450895235432015-01-02T11:03:33.147-05:002015-01-02T11:03:33.147-05:00Excellent post. Very helpful. Thanks Excellent post. Very helpful. Thanks Carol Baldwinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10444182118975929045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-11535493195185038802012-01-16T13:53:21.054-05:002012-01-16T13:53:21.054-05:00Ashi, great story! I bet a lot of writers have gon...Ashi, great story! I bet a lot of writers have gone through that same process to find their right opening (I know I have). And when you do find it, it does flow :) Best of luck with yours, and I hope it sells quickly.Janice Hardyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02356672149097741248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-68202051469563802102012-01-13T20:57:26.326-05:002012-01-13T20:57:26.326-05:00Excellent, analytical article - thank you! I just ...Excellent, analytical article - thank you! I just finished writing my first novel, a literary thriller titled Opium, and it took multiple drafts and mega guidance from my agent, Jenny Bent, for me to find the right opening scene. Opium starts with the protagonist - an investment banker who goes to Burma to raise a fund - trying to flee the nation after she realizes the dangerous predicament she's gotten herself and her fiance into. I tried starting at the linear beginning of the story, but the stakes weren't high enough; and at different points within, which gave away too much or was confusing; but when we hit upon the current opening, it suddenly flowed like honey. Or at least Jenny and I think so! Next stop, publisher submissions, gulp. Fingers and eyes crossed.Ashi Labouissenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-28196657510119763372012-01-13T14:55:51.271-05:002012-01-13T14:55:51.271-05:00Chicoy, that happens more often than you'd thi...Chicoy, that happens more often than you'd think :) Actually, if it's a mystery you're opening is fairly easy. From what my mystery friends tell me, the body needs to show up in the first chapter. (if it's not a murder mystery, then naturally that changes). Perhaps introduce your protag first, then let the other characters come is as your protag discovers them. <br /><br />Haley, sounds good to me :)<br /><br />C0, you might try seeing how the Bryan vs Finn conflict is affected by the Dad conflict at the start. Use the Dad one as the bridge to help get Bryan to the core conflict. Maybe Bryan is scared/embarrassed over what might happen when Dad spends the night and this makes him act a certain way toward Finn.<br /><br />If Bryan has his own conflict with Finn that's separate, you might want to just scrap Dad and start with Mom at the airport. The Dad issue could be something that happens later to make the Bryan/Finn conflict worse. <br /><br />What issue does Bryan have about Finn coming to live with them? That's probably going to drive that opening scene. His worst fear could be something he's worrying about at the end of the chapter. It doesn't have to happen if that doesn't fit the story, but he can worry it will, and see all kinds of hints as to why it might in Finn. He can be wrong, and discovering that might be what helps drive the story moving on.<br /><br />Talking scenes out helps me too :) I spent hours on the phone with my crit partners. <br /><br />Jaleh, good luck!<br /><br />Patti, exactly. That's such a great example of the "normal world" right before things go crazy. And thanks!<br /><br />Laura, oh good!Janice Hardyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02356672149097741248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-6591942179466589712012-01-09T22:54:21.818-05:002012-01-09T22:54:21.818-05:00This was great advice! Reading through the analysi...This was great advice! Reading through the analysis questions, I'm actually surprised (and glad) to say that my wip is probably starting in the right place.Laura Whttp://lauraplusthevoices.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-14740282967828587772012-01-09T22:25:46.013-05:002012-01-09T22:25:46.013-05:00Yesterday I watched "Die Hard" twice. It...Yesterday I watched "Die Hard" twice. It was so well plotted, for sure! His #2 was when he decided to take that plane to see his wife, after six months apart. Right? (He "went left," to San Francisco, instead of "going right," and staying in NY.) We needed the time, short as it was, when he was with his wife before the Big Conflict began.<br /><br />Thanks for another great post! This blog site is so helpful!!patti.mallett_pphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01453756965198648016noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-29142472729832132612012-01-09T20:09:34.657-05:002012-01-09T20:09:34.657-05:00I'm bookmarking this post for when I go back t...I'm bookmarking this post for when I go back to my YA fantasy. The beginning in that one needs so much work to set it at the right point.Jaleh Dhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04942272578488986874noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-35334045828626225532012-01-09T16:55:22.552-05:002012-01-09T16:55:22.552-05:00Oh, sorry for rambling on, but I do know the end r...Oh, sorry for rambling on, but I do know the end result for the scene. I want Bryan to be both intrigued by Finn yet uncertain that they'll be able to form a friendship. I don't want him to get all angry, or that might blow away audience sympathy. I want Bryan want to help Finn.<br /><br />So perhaps end with Bryan unsure whatever he wants to figuratively strangle Finn? How would I achieve that result? Finn is an extremely intoverted person. What remark would make the scene end in disaster?<br /><br />Talking this out like this helps me.chihuahuazerohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15677672177353350936noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-73663208499260202712012-01-09T16:51:31.845-05:002012-01-09T16:51:31.845-05:00This is timely. I'm restarting my draft so I c...This is timely. I'm restarting my draft so I can write scene by scene and get it right this time.<br /><br />However, I'm still not sure how to deliver the conflict in the first scene. (You had seen the earlier version of this scene). I have the narrator (Bryan) and his father exchanging a few jabs before the co-protagonist (Finn) stumbles into the scene. However, I'm not sure how to handle the Bryan vs. Dad conflict and the Bryan vs. Finn conflict, considering that the latter is the core of the story. <br /><br />What Dad and Bryan were arguing over was the fact that despite being divorced, Dad sleeps with Mom every time he visits, and Bryan's afraid this might weird off the exchange student. Problem is, I'm not sure how to shape this into a first scene conflict that unfolds realistically--and not have the readers expect that Bryan vs. Dad will be a main conflict.<br /><br />Should I just scrap the Dad altogether and just have Bryan's Mom pick Finn up? But I'll have to think up a new conflict.<br /><br />Help, please?chihuahuazerohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15677672177353350936noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-31243328963565708702012-01-09T16:34:17.957-05:002012-01-09T16:34:17.957-05:00Great tips! Writing the beginning is often the har...Great tips! Writing the beginning is often the hardest part of any story whether it is flash fiction or a novel.<br /><br />I have had success starting my stories with a hook an ending the first chapter with the inciting incident. My first chapters are very short. I include just enough info for readers to get to know the protagonist before the character's life changes completely.Haley Whitehallhttp://haleywhitehall.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-60296843780785431652012-01-09T16:23:23.083-05:002012-01-09T16:23:23.083-05:00Hmmm... I may have to think about that one.
My ...Hmmm... I may have to think about that one. <br /><br />My problem is that I'm writing a mystery with a ton of suspects, and I'm trying to introduce a lot of (I was going to say people, but creatures would be more appropriate) characters, along with their clashing motivations. <br /><br />I think I'm getting the hang if it, but re-writing these opening chapters feels like it's taken longer than writing the whole first half of the book on my original go-round. Oh how I do hate re-writes, let me count the ways!Chicoryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16504144663440678542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-42258592332480160592012-01-09T16:11:34.430-05:002012-01-09T16:11:34.430-05:00Khanada, that's not an uncommon problem actual...Khanada, that's not an uncommon problem actually. We have "start with the action" drilled into our heads, and start too soon without giving readers a chance to get to know and care before things get crazy. Starting with the internal conflict can work well, as that's the start of the protag's emotional arc. It'll also connect to the external goal in some way to help tie the story together. Good luck with that opening!<br /><br />Angelaaquarles, I agree, starting with the wish will probably feels too rushed. Starting with why she makes the wish sounds like the right spot to me. :)<br /><br />Chicory, have you tried looking at both the internal and external conflicts? Sometimes you can use the character arcs to bridge those gaps. <br /><br />MK, beginnings often change after you see the end :) Probably better too late than too early though. Not as much writing to cut out, hehe.<br /><br />Laura, most welcome!Janice Hardyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02356672149097741248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-47036264014586893462012-01-09T15:12:35.016-05:002012-01-09T15:12:35.016-05:00Love this! I stuggle with where to start...I'm...Love this! I stuggle with where to start...I'm getting closer with each book, but this will help me nail it, first time, and save lots of time!<br /><br />Thanks so much.Laura Drakehttp://lauradrakebooks.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-58438046052355399772012-01-09T13:25:24.577-05:002012-01-09T13:25:24.577-05:00Angela, mine is the same sort of thing. My MC made...Angela, mine is the same sort of thing. My MC made a wish in the first chapter initially, and, yeah - who cares at that point?? I'm hoping stepping back a bit gives us a little more time to get to know her so we'll care when she wishes herself away...<br />Here's hoping our wishes work out better this time! ;-)Khanadahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04705064700657411259noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-61181118846059688992012-01-09T11:14:47.473-05:002012-01-09T11:14:47.473-05:00I usually start too late...but I don't usually...I usually start too late...but I don't usually know that until I finish the book and am working on revisions. By then, I really know what my core conflict is and where everything's going, which makes it possible to get the beginning right. I love the flow chart!MKHutchinshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07715686902529938959noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-20531502677196992152012-01-09T11:01:28.828-05:002012-01-09T11:01:28.828-05:00Great post. Mine is the second problem; figuring ...Great post. Mine is the second problem; figuring how to connect my terrific opening to the story's middle. It's taking a little too long to get there.Chicoryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16504144663440678542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-60047521621125273272012-01-09T09:53:38.265-05:002012-01-09T09:53:38.265-05:00This is timely for me too! Boy am I struggling wit...This is timely for me too! Boy am I struggling with this! I started with some action that did get people intrigued, but after living with it for a long while, I've realized that it just doesn't have anything to do with the rest of the novel. It's a throwaway dramatic entrance. My inciting incident is when my heroine accidentally wishes herself back in time (it's a time-travel romance), but I think if I start right with the wishing, no one would really care yet. She's at a reenactment ball that is not being taken seriously by most of the attendees and she's feeling disappointed and dorky. So I guess I'm starting with her internal conflict which directly leads to her making the wish... I still don't know if it's the right spot, but it's where I am right now. This post will definitely help me analyze it more, thanks!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3901370917824739259.post-20047885080865637582012-01-09T09:33:10.459-05:002012-01-09T09:33:10.459-05:00What timing! Yes, I've struggled big time with...What timing! Yes, I've struggled big time with where to start. I thought I had it, but now I'm not so sure.<br /><br />I think I struggle most with deciding between the external and internal conflicts. Initially, I opened my MG WIP very close to the inciting incident for the external conflict. I participated in an online workshop where I got to show the beginning to an editor, and she said things were happening too fast, before she got a chance to care about the MC. I had to agree.<br /><br />Now I am starting where the internal conflict begins - the MC's best friend (and really only friend) moves away, and this shatters the MC. In order for her to succeed with the external conflict, she needs to get over this and believe in herself. <br /><br />This first chapter is a bit flat so far. I think I just need to keep writing through it to find the spark. And I'll work through the questions you have here and see if I DID find the right spot to start.<br /><br />Thank you!!<br /><br />-- AmyKhanadahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04705064700657411259noreply@blogger.com